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You rank 4,644,679 on AlexaFirefox is 769Opera is 663 I dont think you even get a 1000 downloads a month

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hoe many downloads have you had? Are users reporting any bugs?
Users not reporting any bugs, perhaps they don't want to stretch me for freeware. If someone will report me a bug, I will fix it.You will find NotJustBrowsing in top 10 freeware of February at http://www.freeware-guide.com , when actually I released it on 27th of February (in two days). I expect it to be in that position in March too.How many downloads? Diplomatic answer could be a 4 times increase in traffic on average per day for this version from previous one.People recognised the concept as early as in "May 1, 2005" (visit http://hazeratti.stumbleupon.com/) even when software was of very poor appearance.

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wow you avoided my question twice. I searched for user reviews of your browser and found none. I also looked at the number of downloads from each of the download sites you advertise on there doesn't seem to be very many, maybe 4 or 5 downloads per site.

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You rank 4,644,679 on AlexaFirefox is 769Opera is 663 I dont think you even get a 1000 downloads a month
From start, my intention is not to chase "rankings", I never explicitly employed any technique or paid any money to anyone to increase my page ranking.Google page rank that you see on my website has moved one number up from 4 to 5 in recent times because my software is more known now than before. For a website like mine (though simple) a rank 5/10 should tell a lot.It is more of a shame for IE/Firefox/Opera to be in that position and not providing their users what I am providing. Do you know what made Opera to be available for free?The point is that I am providing a service that neither of them can provide nor they are capable of doing so.It took only 1/5th of the time as compared to others to bring it to this level.Do you know that you are comapring at least 10 years of organizational efforts with a single person's two year's effort? But what is the point in saying that I don't get 1000 downloads/month?

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wow you avoided my question twice. I searched for user reviews of your browser and found none. I also looked at the number of downloads from each of the download sites you advertise on there doesn't seem to be very many, maybe 4 or 5 downloads per site.
As I mentioned earlier, instead of presenting my work of art in front of learned audience to obtain another degree, I presented it in public domain.The person who presented it is unique in his effort so does the reviewer should be. Have you ever seen any software professional to come and defend his creation in public, except ..Even If I am present here in this forum and in another forum to answer any question about my software but did you see anybody questioning?Can you stop using my software because nobody else is downloading?

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I have no idea what you are talking about. I asked oyu a simple question and you are talking in circles about completely unrelated stuff.

It is more of a shame for IE/Firefox/Opera to be in that position and not providing their users what I am providing. Do you know what made Opera to be available for free?The point is that I am providing a service that neither of them can provide nor they are capable of doing so.
So you are a better programmer than everyone at Microsoft, Mozilla, and Opera? Wow oyu have a high opinion of yourself. these companies are focusing on standards compliance and many other features that have been requested.

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hmmmm... This seems like an interesting conversation :)

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I have no idea what you are talking about. I asked oyu a simple question and you are talking in circles about completely unrelated stuff.So you are a better programmer than everyone at Microsoft, Mozilla, and Opera? Wow oyu have a high opinion of yourself. these companies are focusing on standards compliance and many other features that have been requested.
People at Microsoft, Mozilla, Netscape and Opera should get credit for what they have achieved but not for what they did not achieve. A journey towards "nowhere" will take a person to "nowhere".As I said earlier, big organizations develop products progressively, invention is not in their designs.A good programmer will do what he is told to do, if there is no person to tell them what to do they are useless.I answered your question in a manner that suited me because question was not about the product itself.

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I am finding it hard to understand the things you are saying. To show up out of the blue and begin talking about your browser and want us to use it yet you act arrogant, you belittle web standards, you say you are more innovative then many large companies that have help make the web what it is today, and you won't answer a simple question about how many people have downloaded your browser (most likely because very few have).I hope for your sake you never decide to go into marketing or sales.You have successfully made a horrible impression and personnally don't care if your browser is the best thing ever invented. I would never use it and never recommend anyone I know use it.

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Cant you just give a number like 1,00,000 download per month for example!! Just a number not a paragraph about inventions and designs and programmers and big organizations!

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I am finding it hard to understand the things you are saying. To show up out of the blue and begin talking about your browser and want us to use it yet you act arrogant, you belittle web standards, you say you are more innovative then many large companies that have help make the web what it is today, and you won't answer a simple question about how many people have downloaded your browser (most likely because very few have).I hope for your sake you never decide to go into marketing or sales.You have successfully made a horrible impression and personnally don't care if your browser is the best thing ever invented. I would never use it and never recommend anyone I know use it.
If you hear what you want to hear then you will not expand your knowledge base.It is not "out of blue", I applied for membership with my correct name, used my registered trade mark to identify myself. I have been allowed to join in this forum after verification of my credentials. Now that I joined this forum with correct identity, what do you expect me to talk about?One thing for sure, I don't want anybody to use it until they need it. Whenever you see something new, you try to find out if you may need it or not, for humans it is a natural thing.Do you think that I should have pretended as someone else and told "guys, have you seen this browser? it is fantastic, try it"?As far as knowing about standards or infact anything (including programming), I must admit I know very little. But is it about me knowing or not knowing anything? No, it is about you who got the chance to talk about something unusual and refusing to take the opportunity seriously.There is a lot to learn in my not answering your question. Perhaps you don't want to know what happens when someone introduces new things or you already know. People who introduce radical changes, normally end up stoned. Your attitude is nowhere near those people yet.I don't need to tell about something that is visible to everybody.If you will not use it then how you are going to tell others not to use it? It takes a couple of minutes to install and reject a software, for your satisfaction that you didn't miss anything.

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Apparently I have too many quote blocks in my post. I didn't realize there was a limit, and it's not telling me what the limit is, so I will have to split my post up. Part 1 follows.This discussion has become very confusing. I'm having a hard time following the train of thought that is leading to some of these replies. Sigh, let's start at the top...

Anybody using NotJustBrowsing, you can view VSS syndicated contents from YouTube.com on this page http://www.notjustbrowsing.org/poshaak_mah...op10/PopOne.htm
All I can say about that is that you are regressing. You are introducing new tags into an existing specification. Anyone who uses your new tags will never be able to create a web page that validates against any spec currently in acceptance. There are ways for you to recognize things like VSS on a page, for example you could use an object tag which is a part of the spec. Creating your own tag is taking one step forward and two steps back. If you refuse to recognize or acknowledge the efforts of several hundred or thousand people to define a good set of working specs that people can agree on, do not expect anyone involved in that process (especially developers) to support your efforts.
Firefox is 769Opera is 663
Those are impressive numbers for Opera, I'm happy to see that. I've been pushing Opera for a while. It is very impressive to look at the 3-year traffic graph for opera.com, people really took notice when Opera 8 and 9 were released. I'm fairly suprised that the traffic is higher then for Firefox, but I bet that if you added up all of the different Firefox sites (getfirefox.com, mozilla.com/products/firefox etc) I bet the number would favor Firefox over Opera at that point.
Users not reporting any bugs, perhaps they don't want to stretch me for freeware. If someone will report me a bug, I will fix it.
If people are using buggy software that they care about, they will report the bugs. Look at the bug report forum on forum.context.cx for an example, that is also a freeware program developed by one individual. If people aren't reporting bugs, it means one of three things. Either the software does not have any bugs or people aren't finding them, or they don't care enough to report the ones they do find, or people aren't using it in the first place.
It is more of a shame for IE/Firefox/Opera to be in that position and not providing their users what I am providing...The point is that I am providing a service that neither of them can provide nor they are capable of doing so.
I find this statement, and a few others you make, to be slightly offensive. I want you to clarify exactly (specifically) what service you are providing to your users that Microsoft, the Mozilla Foundation, and Opera Software are not doing. Specific examples. Please do not ignore this question or reply with something that does not answer it.
Do you know what made Opera to be available for free?
Yes, I know exactly why. Do you? What I know is that Opera Software was hardly getting any revenue for the Opera browser itself, the primary source of revenue for Opera Software was a combination of advertising and licensing their embedded browser, Opera Mini. The embedded version was standard on many cell phones, such as Nokia, and the revenue from the standalone browser was not significant in contrast. Opera Software made the decision, correctly in my opinion, that if they released the browser for free it would translate to higher revenues in other areas. For example, the only browser you can use on the Nintendo Wii platform is the Opera browser. When the full browser was released completely free of charge it met with much wider support from the free/open source community then it enjoyed as a free, ad-supported version.So what's your point?
Do you know that you are comapring at least 10 years of organizational efforts with a single person's two year's effort?
No, sir, you are comparing your efforts with their efforts. If you are going to come in here and talk about how no one is able to do what you are doing, you better expect and be ready for some fierce resistance, because, frankly, that statement is arrogant bull****. I'm sorry if you disagree and I'm sorry if that offends you, but that's what it is. If you disagree, you better give concrete, specific examples of exactly what you are doing that no one else is apparently even capable of doing.
The person who presented it is unique in his effort so does the reviewer should be. Have you ever seen any software professional to come and defend his creation in public, except ..
I don't really understand the language you are using here, but are you trying to say that software professionals do not defend their software in public? I'm sorry, have you never heard of Linux? Or Firefox for that matter? I know that you would love to believe that you are a beautiful, unique snowflake and there is no other person capable of doing what you can, but let me tell you man, that just is not the case. And frankly, it's a bit of an insult to every other software developer out there (including myself) for you to come here and say that you are so great and unique and no one has ever been able to do what you can. That, also, is bull****.
Even If I am present here in this forum and in another forum to answer any question about my software but did you see anybody questioning?Can you stop using my software because nobody else is downloading?
Those two statements make absolutely no sense to me, and I suspect that I am now less intelligent for having read them.
People at Microsoft, Mozilla, Netscape and Opera should get credit for what they have achieved but not for what they did not achieve. A journey towards "nowhere" will take a person to "nowhere".
Again, this is a highly inflammatory, and offensive, statement. Really, Opera is on a journey nowhere, you say? Take a look at their Alexa traffic analysis graphs for the past several years. The only place they are going is up. And who is driving Opera up? Well, it is the public. Opera released their product to the public, they defended it, they advertised it, and people like it and saw that it is useful. Considering the fact that your entire argument has been about the public seeing the benefit of your work and whatnot, I think it would be pretty hypocritical of you to conclude that Opera is going nowhere when they are enjoying more public support for their product then they ever have.

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Part 2:

As I said earlier, big organizations develop products progressively, invention is not in their designs.
That is one of the single most rediculous statements I've read in this topic so far. Big organizations do not invent??? ARE YOU SERIOUS??? At this point I'm beginning to suspect that this whole discussion has been a joke. Are you aware of how many patents companies like IBM, Microsoft, Adobe, AT&T etc etc etc have? Do you know what is patentable? A new invention is patentable. When AT&T Bell Labs invented, no, excuse me, progressively developed, the transistor, or Unix, or the C programming language, what exactly did they base all of this stuff on? What did they improve upon to invent a transistor? More importantly, what is your point? Are you seriously trying to imply that you are all about invention, invention, invention, and the largest companies on the planet just can't do that? WHO THE ###### DO YOU THINK WORKS FOR THOSE COMPANIES? Do they hire robots? Or do they hire the best and brightest people working in their fields?
A good programmer will do what he is told to do, if there is no person to tell them what to do they are useless.
Oh, please. A good programmer does not need to be told what to do. Who told Linus Torvalds how to build Linux? Who told Zeev Suraski and Andi Gutmans how to build the Zend engine? Who told Kernighan and Ritchie how to design the C programming language? Who told John Carmack how to build a 3D game engine? Who told Bram Cohen how to build BitTorrent? Your arguments are rediculous at best, inflammatory and inciteful at worst.
I answered your question in a manner that suited me
You're in the wrong field, you should go into politics.
If you hear what you want to hear then you will not expand your knowledge base.
Expand your knowledge base? What do you mean? Is that like researching the current state and specifications of your chosen industry before you try to design the next best thing?
One thing for sure, I don't want anybody to use it until they need it.
Something we can agree on. I will never use your product until I feel like I have a need for it.
As far as knowing about standards or infact anything (including programming), I must admit I know very little. But is it about me knowing or not knowing anything?
YES! How the heck are you going to design the next best thing if you don't even know what the current best thing is?!!!! How the heck are you going to expect anyone to take your arguments seriously if you don't understand what you're talking about in the first place?!!!!
People who introduce radical changes, normally end up stoned.
I think you may already be stoned. But get serious man, you're not some pariah or martyr or unjust victim, you're a guy trying to pimp his new web browser. There's nothing radical about that, and contrary to what you may be thinking, I'm not arguing about whether or not you have the huge vision that you think you do. I am arguing because you are totally oblivous to the current state of the internet industry, and you're coming in here trying to tell everyone that what they are doing is crap, and thank god you finally arrived, because now we can finally use the internet to its potential. If you were a little more educated in the industry you are trying to make a name for yourself in, then you would garner a little more respect from me. Right now I don't have a lot of respect to offer you. Right off the bat you showed up and became argumentative and defensive when everyone who has some clue about the internet industry is trying to tell you that you are not building a third-generation browser. That's how all this started.
If you will not use it then how you are going to tell others not to use it?
Well that's easy.random guy: Hey Steve, have you heard about NotJustBrowsing?Steve: Yeah. It's designed and built by someone who doesn't know anything about what anyone else is doing in web development. He refuses to even acknowledge that standards may be a good thing. You can try it if you want, some of the features may be beneficial to you, but I consider it to be a step backward in the work that we have accomplished as a community over the past several years.And, finally:
If someone will report me a bug, I will fix it.
Oh, really? Well, I found a bug. It seems that your third-generation browser does not even support the second-generation specifications. When can I expect a fix for this?

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As far as knowing about standards or infact anything (including programming), I must admit I know very little.
Well, there it is really. If you know little about standards, and admit to it, perhaps you should not start developing a browser, not knowing the basic cornerstones of the net (the languages html and css and the respective standards of them trying to be established by the W3C. You're on a forum of webdesigners/developers/programmers who are pretty much all frustrated by the fact that they have to use extra hours (and, if a job, clients' money) to develop a site that looks the same in all browsers to ensure the end-user (or client, but with another meaning than the last instance of the word) gets the same result no-matter the browser they want to use. That's the WHOLE point of standards, setting a base of rules for what is valid html/css code, and how a browser is supposed to render these things. Even today, Internet Explorer doesn't have support for all of the CSS 2 Spesification, and hardly any support for anything of CSS 3. It's horrible really, and requires coding sites with little "hacks" (work-arounds) and quirks. A forum like this, with people defending and demanding standards die-hard, it may not be the best place to advertize your browser with hope of success.
People who introduce radical changes, normally end up stoned.
I think you may already be stoned.
No pun intended I guess? Or was that all about the double-entendre? :)
It is not "out of blue", I applied for membership with my correct name, used my registered trade mark to identify myself. I have been allowed to join in this forum after verification of my credentials. Now that I joined this forum with correct identity, what do you expect me to talk about?
Actually, if the only reason you came here was to advertize your browser, you came here for all the wrong reasons. Of course, this is a place to get good constructive criticism, but if you don't care what people tell you and just maintain that your browser is the best anyway, it's just advertizing and border-line spam.

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The only thing I can add to all of the above is that you start thinking of building a new browser engine and then start advertising it again.By a new engine I mean a different way to render web pages. IE, Firefox and Opera use their own engines and your browser is based on IE's, the same way K-Melion is based on Firefox and Maxtron is based on IE. If you want to get anywhere in the browser making industry, you'll need to create a new engine. If you make it more standart compilant then any existing one (or at least just as good), you'll reach the high grounds that the current browser vendors have and you'll prove all of us here wrong about you...rrr browser.

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One thing I just realized that people who are talking big and using this character (#), their ages are less than my experience in the industry. That is the reason that they are not understanding a word of what I am writing.For example

As I said earlier, big organizations develop products progressively, invention is not in their designs.
That is one of the single most rediculous statements I've read in this topic so far. Big organizations do not invent??? ARE YOU SERIOUS??? At this point I'm beginning to suspect that this whole discussion has been a joke. Are you aware of how many patents companies like IBM, Microsoft, Adobe, AT&T etc etc etc have? Do you know what is patentable? A new invention is patentable. When AT&T Bell Labs invented, no, excuse me, progressively developed, the transistor, or Unix, or the C programming language, what exactly did they base all of this stuff on? What did they improve upon to invent a transistor? More importantly, what is your point? Are you seriously trying to imply that you are all about invention, invention, invention, and the largest companies on the planet just can't do that? WHO THE ###### DO YOU THINK WORKS FOR THOSE COMPANIES? Do they hire robots? Or do they hire the best and brightest people working in their fields?
In one short sentence, "people invent for organizations to exploit". Yes, organizations do not invent and that is what you have written as well. Do you think hiring inventors is same as inventing? You have gone too far without understanding what is written?
Oh, please. A good programmer does not need to be told what to do. Who told Linus Torvalds how to build Linux? Who told Zeev Suraski and Andi Gutmans how to build the Zend engine? Who told Kernighan and Ritchie how to design the C programming language? Who told John Carmack how to build a 3D game engine? Who told Bram Cohen how to build BitTorrent? Your arguments are rediculous at best, inflammatory and inciteful at worst.
Perhaps you don't know the distinction between a programmer and a designer/systems engineer. A designer can also be a programmer but a programmer is not yet a designer. Sooner or later you will realize that things like "Linux", "Zend" engine etc are not because of their creators programming skills but because of their design skills.
Oh, really? Well, I found a bug. It seems that your third-generation browser does not even support the second-generation specifications. When can I expect a fix for this?
This bug is due to you people writing standards without consultation with the implementors. That is why I am saying that you are going "nowhere" with this "standard" business. Take my word for it, count on my experience which is more than your age. These organizations will sign on to a standard and implement a different standard. Don't be angry on me if you are unable to chase these people to follow non-binding standards.If there is such thing as standard then it should also be seen inside organizations, specially your favourite one (Microsoft). What standard did microsoft follow when designing .NET 1 and what made them change their standard for .NET 2, not to mention the C++ language change in each of their version.
Actually, if the only reason you came here was to advertize your browser. .
No.Sorry, it is wrong place for me. I apologise for my presence in this forum.

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I can't stop laughing long enough to reply...If you have been in this industry so long then where have you been? Locked i n a basement? Web standards is at the core of designing for the web. A design noob knows this from the simple fact that their page looks different in different browsers.So how old are you, how long have you been programming? More than 25 years? Because to make your statement about having more experience than we are old would require you to be at least 40-45 and have 25+ years experience.I am 25 and have 7 years experience. I don't know everything but it is obvious I know far more about standards and designing and marketing than you do and I know enough to realize you are a complete joke.Why don't you go join a cooking forum or some other group that know nothing about programming or web standards, you might actually convince some of them about your ridiculous claims.

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I can't stop laughing long enough to reply...If you have been in this industry so long then where have you been? Locked i n a basement? Why don't you go join a cooking forum or some other group that know nothing about programming or web standards, you might actually convince some of them about your ridiculous claims.
Hah haha..please aspnetguy, dont talk to Newbies like that or I will have to ban your account and IP :) LOL
Those are impressive numbers for Opera, I'm happy to see that. I've been pushing Opera for a while. It is very impressive to look at the 3-year traffic graph for opera.com, people really took notice when Opera 8 and 9 were released. I'm fairly suprised that the traffic is higher then for Firefox, but I bet that if you added up all of the different Firefox sites (getfirefox.com, mozilla.com/products/firefox etc) I bet the number would favor Firefox over Opera at that point.
Yup, I just took that stats of the one with the highest, if we add up then FF will be better!

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Take my word for it, count on my experience which is more than your age.
That sentence is extremely arrogant, and it reminds me of someone... I'll leave that sentence hanging for those who catch on.
If there is such thing as standard then it should also be seen inside organizations, specially your favourite one (Microsoft).
Whose favourite now?! Where the ###### did you get the impression we like Micro$oft? :)
What standard did microsoft follow when designing .NET 1 and what made them change their standard for .NET 2, not to mention the C++ language change in each of their version.
Standards for programming languages is a whole nother chapter than structure languages like html. No one here could care less what programming language you use, as long as it outputs correct html and css. It's standards for those languages we're pushing, because that's what matters in a browser*, everything else is for the server to support, and the end-user/client doesn't see that anyway as long as it works and doesn't produce errors. You could make your own language to output html and css, as long as you've also developed a program to parse the code. In fact, that's precisely what Rasmus Lerdorf did in 1994 when he invented what was to be called PHP (originally Personal Home Page Tools, and later, of course, PHP: Hypertext Preprocessor).*Of course other things matter in a browser, like security etc., but strictly speaking for when developing for the net, it's standards for client-side languages that is important.

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Well, my current favorite is Firefox..but I hope it soon becomes Safari :)

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Whose favourite now?! Where the ###### did you get the impression we like Micro$oft? :)
His strategy seems to be to throw out foolish and unrelated statements when someone disagrees or opposes his claims which only re-enforces how little he knows about what he is talking about.

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One thing I just realized that people who are talking big and using this character (#), their ages are less than my experience in the industry. That is the reason that they are not understanding a word of what I am writing.
Don't assume to know anything about me other then what I'm telling you. You don't know what my age, education, or experience is, and I'm not going to get in a pissing contest with you to figure out who knows more. My language is a reflection of my frustration dealing with your logic (or lack thereof) and arguments.
Perhaps you don't know the distinction between a programmer and a designer/systems engineer. A designer can also be a programmer but a programmer is not yet a designer. Sooner or later you will realize that things like "Linux", "Zend" engine etc are not because of their creators programming skills but because of their design skills.
Thanks man, I've been through the software engineering classes too, I know how to design software. When we were in school, we weren't saying "wow, that Bram Cohen really is a great designer/systems engineer". People like Torvalds, Carmack, and Cohen are known for being programmers, not designers. They are wonderful designers, but the whole package as a general "programmer" is what makes them great. I'm not talking about a "programmer" as someone who sits there and strictly writes code based on a specification that someone else wrote, without any design. A good programmer (your original language did specifiy good programmer) can do all the design and programming they need. Someone who is good in design or writing code but not good in the other is not a good programmer.
This bug is due to you people writing standards without consultation with the implementors.
How effective do you think a standard would be if the implementors were not involved in the process? See man, this is why I use the language that I do. I have said repeatedly that the committees responsible for writing the standards make every effort to get the feedback of everyone else in the field, especially the implementors. Just because you chose to not be a part of that process doesn't mean that now you get to ignore what everyone decided on. You can't sit there and not vote for the president, and then go out the next day and complain about who got elected. (I know you don't have a president where you live, it's an example) It's difficult to express the frustration I'm having trying to get you to understand these concepts, and why standards are a benefit to the entire community, I cannot comprehend how someone can't understand that. My first impression would be to say that you are so young and inexperienced that you don't know what it was like before we had standards, but apparently you have more experience then everyone here put together, so I have no clue what your excuse is for not knowing.
These organizations will sign on to a standard and implement a different standard.
I assume you are talking about vendors. It is a vendor's job to support a given standard. If they want to add additional things, like ActiveX or whatever new thing Microsoft wants to infect the internet with, that's fine, as long as they implement the standard as well. People are upset with Microsoft because they add all their own crap and don't pay any attention to the standards. Firefox seems to focus strictly on standards, and lets the community deal with features and extras. And Opera seems to be able to push ahead on the standards and at the same time add new features themselves. The point is that Firefox and Opera are earning the respect of the community because they have an obvious focus on standards. Microsoft has earned negative respect from the community because they focus on proprietary technologies that no one else can use and basically ignore the standards, and web developers have to suffer as a result of being required to support IE.
If there is such thing as standard then it should also be seen inside organizations, specially your favourite one (Microsoft). What standard did microsoft follow when designing .NET 1 and what made them change their standard for .NET 2, not to mention the C++ language change in each of their version.
See man, this is exactly why I get so frustrated. I don't believe for a second that you have more experience then me, and I'm really starting to doubt that you are even older then I am. I can read your sentence 1 time and the hypocrisy is immediately apparent, I don't know why you can't see it.Let's see here.. now you are claiming that apparently we like Microsoft. Why don't you read through this forum, especially this very thread, and find out what we think about Microsoft. YOU, on the other hand, are pushing a browser that you built with a Microsoft programming language, the Microsoft .NET framework, and the Microsoft web browser engine. So who is in bed with Microsoft? Is it really a surprise that someone implementing a browser using .NET and IE is totally oblivious to the world of standards? And to answer your question, Microsoft did not follow any standard when developing .NET, that's why you require everyone who downloads your software to also download the .NET framework installer, which is 5 times larger then your product. If you had chosen to use a technology that is standardized, like ANSI C++, then that wouldn't be a problem.
Sorry, it is wrong place for me. I apologise for my presence in this forum.
Your presence is fine, just open your ears and stop trying to defend a non-defendable position.

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