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Text alignment problem


pahiker
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I am having problems aligning my text in the header portion of my page http://AlleghenyTrails.com. I can either get it to work for the whole world, or for IE (of course), right now it is setup to work with IE.The issue is with the initial vertical position of the text, if it works in IE then it is too low everywhere else; if it works everywhere else then in IE it is too high.Arggh!

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No need to use position absolutes, break tags and more importantly, FRAMES! Frames are not going to help you with SEO. Search the forum and you will find that using FRAME is no longer recommended (don't confuse this with iframes)You've set your site title and menu within the same paragraph tag which can make it more complicated to position. If you use two divs within that table cell and float them where you have the title in one div at the top and the menu in another div for the bottom. You can then easily set the heights for each div. Thereafter, you can use margins/paddings to position the contents of the two divs in the approximate location you desire.

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It's later in the day, and I don't know if you've worked on this or not. I'm Firefox 3.01 MAC and I don't see the alignment issues you speak of. Maybe that's the browser, I don't know.I do encourage you to get rid of frames and also tables for layout purposes. (Tres 1997!) Everything you're doing you can do with divs and do better and easier.FWIW, I grew up in Maryland and I was all over the AT in your part of the world. Uh, 30-35 years ago. I'm in Utah now, specifically the Wasatch range of the western Rockies. You don't find the springs and streams like you do back east, but there's also no humidity, which makes hiking much more pleasant. And since valley level is a mile up, a 3000 foot climb sets us up for COOOLD overnighters, even in July.

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I realize frames are old, and when IE5.5 becomes as antiquated as frames are then I will remove them. I have another site that took me weeks to get to work in everything (http://HikingTheAlleghenies.com), including IE5.5, I am not interested in reproducing that effort again.Also, the ISP that I am working with (comcast) does not support SSI, which provides additional limitations, and heavier maintenance effort. I will be changing ISP's, but the new one is going to be FIOS, which probably isn't going to be much better.Thanks for the help, I did get it working by making some of the changes suggested.MikeDD, yeah, it's humid as ###### here (good days are in the 45% range), but I love the mountains, the foliage, and the wildlife -- I can put up with it (I only hike Sept. - May).

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I realize frames are old, and when IE5.5 becomes as antiquated as frames are then I will remove them.
That won't happen, as the HTML 4.01 specification (the first to strictly exclude frames) came out on December 1999, and IE 6 (the successor to IE 5.5) came out on August 2001. Just... don't use frames! :)
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what you can do is specify it for IE as for Fx.just put a hash in front of the line. Only IE reads that.#content { text-align: left; #text-align: center;}IE will align the text in the center and the rest aligns it left.
Left-right alignment wasn't the problem, up-down was.
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That won't happen, as the HTML 4.01 specification (the first to strictly exclude frames) came out on December 1999, and IE 6 (the successor to IE 5.5) came out on August 2001. Just... don't use frames! :)
You expect every browser to stop supporting frames immediately? People will drop 5.5 long before browsers stop supporting frames (they still support /B and /I long after they were dropped).
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You expect every browser to stop supporting frames immediately? People will drop 5.5 long before browsers stop supporting frames (they still support /B and /I long after they were dropped).
According to W3Schools, in June 2008 only 0.5% of people used IE 5.5, down 0.2% from May. I don't know how many sites still use frames but I'm going to write a spider to find out as soon as I get home :)Well, I suppose its your choice, but HTML that works isn't necessarily HTML that is good.
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According to W3Schools, in June 2008 only 0.5% of people used IE 5.5, down 0.2% from May.
If I remember, their stats are based on the people accessing their sites, not the entire net. The people here tend to be ahead of the average user.When I built my other site, earlier this year, I was blasted by this group because it didn't work with IE5.5 which, they claimed, was 40% of the market. I seriously doubt that there has been that much of a change in usage since May.
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Ok, my spider did a standard link crawl beginning from http://www.w3.org/. It accessed 1837 pages, out of which 7 used frames or iframes. That is 0.38% of the pages read, which is a bit less than the 0.5% of people accessing W3Schools using IE 5.5.Even if the W3School's statistics are not entirely accurate, I seriously doubt that IE 5.5 still has a 40% market share. 2%, maybe...

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Ok, my spider did a standard link crawl beginning from http://www.w3.org/. It accessed 1837 pages, out of which 7 used frames or iframes. That is 0.38% of the pages read, which is a bit less than the 0.5% of people accessing W3Schools using IE 5.5.Even if the W3School's statistics are not entirely accurate, I seriously doubt that IE 5.5 still has a 40% market share. 2%, maybe...
Fine, you have just validated my complaint from May, I spent 3 weeks reworking my site (to the satisfaction of those here helping me) to support a browser that is now insignificant.Now, convince me that the number of browsers not supporting frames is significant and I will rework my site. Otherwise, until I am ready to scrap everything I've done and start over the frames will stand. Especially since I'm sure that there are significant CSS features that IE still doesn't support, and I would still have to spend hours in redesign trying to get things to work everywhere.
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Now, convince me that the number of browsers not supporting frames is significant and I will rework my site. Otherwise, until I am ready to scrap everything I've done and start over the frames will stand. Especially since I'm sure that there are significant CSS features that IE still doesn't support, and I would still have to spend hours in redesign trying to get things to work everywhere.
SEO is one super good reason to not use frame regardless if frames are support or not. Page will not get indexed except for the root or home page. Of course you can add a sitemap to resolve this problemBut from a user's perspective, my number one complaint about sites being done in frames is: I can't bookmark the exact page I like to save.Now, you don't have to scrap your whole site. Just take it out of frames. Learn a bit about php or asp includes and you can get the same results as you would with frames but only that it's better.
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SEO is one super good reason to not use frame regardless if frames are support or not. Page will not get indexed except for the root or home page. Of course you can add a sitemap to resolve this problemBut from a user's perspective, my number one complaint about sites being done in frames is: I can't bookmark the exact page I like to save.Now, you don't have to scrap your whole site. Just take it out of frames. Learn a bit about php or asp includes and you can get the same results as you would with frames but only that it's better.
1) I only want the root page indexed, so frames are more of a plus in this situation.2) I don't want people bookmarking individual pages, the main page contains pertinent information which will be missed if you skip to an inside page.3) As I stated earlier, my ISP is comcast (soon to be verizon), they do not support anything outside of standard html/css. I will not be changing providers, so I need to code within their limitations.
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1) I only want the root page indexed, so frames are more of a plus in this situation.
This is what a search engine will see of your index page:
Allegheny Trails Hiking Club
Because there is no content on that page. Not very good for SEO.But in the end as i said its your choice, I suppose. Just be aware that frames are old, are not in the current strict DTDs and are extremely bad for SEO and usability.
Especially since I'm sure that there are significant CSS features that IE still doesn't support, and I would still have to spend hours in redesign trying to get things to work everywhere.
Isn't it fun to redesign things all the time? :)Don't worry, its not as hard as you think to get things working in IE.
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