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IE8 beta 2


justsomeguy
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For anyone doing much testing or development on IE, IE8 beta 2 has been released and it has a great developer tools section. Using the developer tools, you can switch the browser mode between IE7, IE8, or IE8 "compatibility view", you can switch the page between quirks mode, IE7 standards, or IE8 standards, and it has a lot of support for Javascript, CSS, and HTML inspecting and debugging. The menus and tabs in the developer tools have a ton of other tools to help debug the page, so it looks like a great resource to help with IE 8 debugging. If you can truly run it in IE7 mode then it would be the best debugger available for IE7, which is the current major browser version. I haven't messed around with it much yet, but it looks good. You can download it here:http://www.microsoft.com/windows/internet-explorer/beta/Check the release notes also, depending on how updated you keep your system (or if you installed beta 1), you might have to uninstall or reinstall some things.

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I haven't given it a try. Probably will wait and upgrade when the RTM is released. I have pretty much decided when IE8 is fully released I am dropping IE6 support, unless a client demands it. We have already "unoffically" dropped IE6 at work for our hosted applications.

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I made the sysadmin leave IE6 on a server that nobody works on much so I can test it if I have too. There are a few clients that insist on using it even though we have told them we don't support it and requested they upgrade. Oh well. I am considering using conditional comments and placing a small message to IE6 users asking that they upgrade maybe even link to a page outlining the benefits of doing so.

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Guest FirefoxRocks

Installation requires 2-3 reboots. If you have Windows XP SP3, you must uninstall that first. If you have IE8 Beta 1, you must uninstall that first.As for supporting IE6, I wish I could, but I don't even have it to test anymore now that I'm running either Ubuntu, openSUSE or Windows Vista. The IEs4Linux versions of IE 6 and 5.5 are a bit off for intense testing, just to see how the page looks is fine.

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Installation requires 2-3 reboots. If you have Windows XP SP3, you must uninstall that first. If you have IE8 Beta 1, you must uninstall that first.
Wha'? Really? I thought that the chain goes like1. Windows SPX (IE6)2. if (X !== 3) { SP3 (IE6) }3. IE74. IE8bXand should be installed in that order. Then, if you want to uninstall one in the chain, you need to uninstall all below it first. i.e. if you wanted to uninstall SP3, uninstall IE8bX and IE7 first. If you want to uninstall IE8bX, uninstall it, and you'll go back to IE7.If installed in another chain, you'd have to follow the chain you did instead, and this can often lead to illogical uninstallations and a combination that isn't as good as it can be. For example:1. Windows SPX (IE6)2. IE73. if (X !== 3) { SP3 (IE7) }4. IE8bXIn that case, if you wanted to remove IE7, you'd wanted to remove IE7, you'd have to remove IE8bX and SP3 first, which is counterintuitive (SP3 contains security updates for IE6, and you don't get them).The combination you're reffering to is likely:1. Windows SPX (IE6)2. IE73. IE8bX4. if (X !== 3) { SP3 (IE7) }In that case, yeah, if you want to install IE8b2, you'd need to remove both SP3 and IE8b1.But yes, if you want IE8b2, you need to remove IE8b1. That's completely logical and fine by me. Let THAT be the big problem with IE8.
As for supporting IE6, I wish I could, but I don't even have it to test anymore now that I'm running either Ubuntu, openSUSE or Windows Vista. The IEs4Linux versions of IE 6 and 5.5 are a bit off for intense testing, just to see how the page looks is fine.
MS VirtualPC? VMWare? *insertLinuxEquivalentHere*?
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You kind of need a working copy of Windows to install on a virtual PC, don't you?
Well, you did said "or Windows Vista" which is why I included it. What about the rest though? I mean, any of those?
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Guest FirefoxRocks
Well, you did said "or Windows Vista" which is why I included it. What about the rest though? I mean, any of those?
I didn't mean a copy of Windows to run the virtual machine on, I meant a copy of Windows to run within the virtual machine. And you can't run IE6 in Vista I don't think.Oh and here is some more information about IE8 Beta 2: http://news.cnet.com/8301-17939_109-100274...tml?tag=nl.e776
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It's actually called InPrivate, and is similar to Safari's Private Browsing.
When I said "named Porn Mode", I of course meant "publicly named Porn Mode" by someone. Let's face it, what serious company would call any feature of their product that? :)
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IE8's cracks are already starting to show. This is very dis heartening http://weblog.infoworld.com/enterprisedesk...consumes_m.htmlI really wanted to believe things were turning around. I don't care if it were the best browser on earth. I wouldn't use any browser that hogged 400MB of RAM. And I thought Firefox3 was bad.

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IE8's cracks are already starting to show. This is very dis heartening http://weblog.infoworld.com/enterprisedesk...consumes_m.htmlI really wanted to believe things were turning around. I don't care if it were the best browser on earth. I wouldn't use any browser that hogged 400MB of RAM. And I thought Firefox3 was bad.
I have IE8b2 on Windows Vista Ultimate x64 SP1 and I have 2GB RAM, Intel Pentium D 2.80GHz, GForce 8600GT and a 250GB Seagate HDD.Having one tab in IE8, Windows Media Player, Norton 360, Task Manager, Aero, DreamScene (video desktop), Apache (+ Apache Monitor), MySQL (+ MySQL's tray monitor), FileZilla's FTP server, Daemon Tools with 4 vitual drives and FlashGet 1.9.6 all turned on.... it all consumes only ~970MB RAM and the CPU is between 15% and 30% depending on what exactly I am doing.As far reaction time is concerned - it all rocks. IE8b2 rocks ###### lot more than IE8b1 or IE7 ever did. And I'm still wondering how smooth the rest of the software I have is running. I mean... Norton 360? Last time I read a review of a Symantec product, it said it consumes a ton of RAM. Well, it is truly more expensive than say, NOD32, but it does a great job and doesn't hang my system. And at the end of the day, that's all that matters - the PC must be responsive when you need it to and applications need to work. Both of those are happening for me.OK... here's a real irony. I was about to put a mojave link here, but when trying to do that, I just experienced a plugin problem... Flash or SilverLight. I'm not sure. The problem was that a black box remained as I closed the first video. Compatability mode on, the video box is still there. Restart IE, closing the animation keeps the sound on. Weird, huh? Still, for me there's a difference between an IE problem and an IE plugin problem, so I remain happy with IE8.[edit]I believe (though I don't know for certain) that the multiple processes and threads may be due to IE8's attempts to isolate and recover from crashes. When a crash happens, only the thread/process is gone, rather than the whole process tree.[/edit]
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I was going to say IE8's resource usage might only be because it's in beta (and it might be), but it's pretty shocking that it uses 150-200 threads. I wouldn't notice the performance penalty at home (I didn't even look at resource usage), but I'm curious to see if it's doing the same on my machine. Memory is one thing, I mean it's unfortunate if it uses 400MB, but I have the memory available and Firefox 3 will still use up that much periodically. But the massive amount of concurrent threads shows that it is doing a ton of work to use all those resources, sort of makes you wonder why it needs so many threads (and 6 discrete processes?).

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Guest FirefoxRocks

Each tab is its own process to maintain product stability. If 1 tab crashes, it doesn't crash the entire browser.This is an excellent feature that will be implemented in Google Chrome.

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Running things in isolation is always good, but there's something wrong if each tab requires many threads to run.
Maybe each engine and parser of IE runs in it's own thread, and each process (tab) creates its own threads of them.I mean, for most web apps you needURL EvaluatorHTTP ComposerResource manager and downloader (also evaluates cache entries)HTML ParserCSS ParserJScript parserHTML RendererCSS Evaluator (matches properties against their selectors)CSS RendererJScript Execution engineSo up that point we already have 11 threads (the browser window thread included). I'm betting there's even more behind displaying a page than that, so even more threads may be required. And the browser uses multiple threads so that it can run all of the above things in parralel, and it keeps them on even after page load so that JScript can have quick access to them.
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google chrome to the rescue
I've been using Chrome today and it is very nice. Mind you it lacks a lot of options and there are no extensions but it is very fast. Compare Canvascape (http://www.abrahamjoffe.com.au/ben/canvascape/) in Chrome and then Firefox (try textured mode too) and see the difference in performance
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